Scottish Independence Referendum 2

gizlaroc

I said we still have wages that are higher than many parts of Europe. We do.

I didn't say our wages were higher than everyone, just that we have wages that re higher than many parts of Europe, and in the context of my post talking about products often being offered the same price in € as £ it means that we have had it pretty easy while it was at €1.40 to the £.




I really don't see what that has to do with the discussion.
I don't employee anyone on the importing side.
I don't employ anyone who is non British on my retail side either.



My point was, and you know this, was sometimes it is nice to read the stories of Brexit from outside of the UK, they don't seem to be quite so doom and gloom as most of the British press.
The problem is, for us, in the UK we will always worry more than someone outside as it is our future that is uncertain.

nabby

So we shouldn't compare ourselves to other more developed Western European nations, just to the ex-Soviet block and southern European basket cases?

If you can't see we are the worst of our peers (and the 5th biggest economy, or is it 6th now, I'm not sure) for wage levels with the evidence staring you in the face, then I want your Kool-Ade to drink please.

Only that as a business owner and employer you are responsible for how much your employees are paid. Which was one of your original statements, that the UK has high wages in comparison to other European countries.

As you don't want to accept that we aren't high in comparison to our peers in Europe, only to the Eastern block and southern European basket cases, then your statement might be based on you being a generous payer to your workers. So I was wondering if that was the basis of your original statement.

But I'm now confused. You say you don't employ anyone on the importing side, implying you alone manage importing of shoes. Fair enough.  But you say you do employ people, just not anyone who isn't British (got no issue with that). So you do have employees, it would seem.


And yet, aside from the Guardian and the occasional article in the Times or Telegraph or Mirror, almost everything in the press here is telling us how everything is rosy. I'm not seeing or reading much doom and gloom, aside from the occasional pop at the Government for appearing to look disorganised and lacking planning or plans.

la gran siete

The higher cost of imports will mean those at the bottom of the wages scale will feel the brunt of it .It is estimated that they stand to be about £800 pa worse off .Whilst I was against Scottish independence in the past I am all for it now because the likes of Sturgeon don't wish to thrust Scotland down a path it clealry does not wish to follow, one of decreasing prosperity

nabby

Ex soviet block / southern European basket cases like Austria you mean?

List of European countries by average wage - Wikipedia (net annual euro column).

We are above the EU average, so the point was correct that our wages are generally higher than the EU.

gizlaroc

I think if Scotland wish to remain in a union with their biggest training partner they will find that is the UK and not the EU.

The total value of exports outside the UK in 2011 was £23.9bn.  Their 'exports' to the rest of the UK in the same year were £45.5bn.

gizlaroc

Except the words the EU were never used for the original point.

And remind me how much larger our economy is to the Austrian one please.

nabby

The original point you have taken issue with was....

Plus we still tend to have wages that are higher than many parts of Europe as well.

This is factually correct no matter how much you want to restrict what is being compared.

gizlaroc

OK, let's look at the Reinis Fischer figure for wages for the last full financial year, which also includes 2014 as well....

                                                                                                                                               

Now, with a drop in the £ we will of course drop down the table, the currency drop could put us close to Italy.

But I stand by what I say, many EU countries seem to be in the €1800-2200 range and then the other big range seems to be the €700-1000 range. With a couple of others on the edge earning a lot more or a lot less.

We are sitting either right near the top or in the top half, which is quite a fair bit better than the other half of the EU.

But, once again you seem to miss the point of what was being discussed.
I was saying that for quite a long time now we have been getting product at much cheaper prices than the EU, Mercs, BMWs at 30% less than from Germany, go to a supermarket in Spain, Italy, France and Germany and food is all 30% cheaper. And that is product you can buy in both countries, Illy coffee, Marmite!
Which says the pound was over valued.

All I said was, we also have higher wages here, it is not like our wages are 30% lower than Spain or Italys, which might make seeing lower prices over there easier to understand.

We have just got used to seeing an inflated £, and now we are not we are having to pay the same price for goods as the rest of the EU and we don't like it.

nabby

No, that wasn't my statement, I simply said the UK still has higher wages than many parts of Europe, even if you reduce 2015 figures by 25%.

I don't accept we are only high compared to eastern bloc countries.




I will try and explain this very slowly, as you say you get easily confused.

I have a business importing footwear, I don't employ anyone, I deal with factories across Europe and India, I then sell those shoes to retailers across the UK.

I also have a retail business, in which I do employ people. None of those people are non British because I am in Norfolk and no one who is non British has ever applied for a job with me.

I now get you were trying to be a click dick and catch me out. If I had realised you were one of those I would have either taken more time explaining the intricacies of my working life to you or more likely, simply told you were to go.


I am sure you will be back dissecting my replies, but to be honest I can't be bothered with it. I simply gave my opinion on a matter that was being discussed from a perspective of someone in business who is already dealing with the issues we are facing at the moment, I couldn't really give two hoots whether you think I am right or wrong, it was just the facts and there is no right or wrong, that is for you to decide.
And it has now taken this topic way off line.

gizlaroc

So if I agree with you, I'm ok, but if I don't I'm a "click dick" in your eyes. I'll happily apologise for rubbing you up the wrong way - that was never my intention.

I wasn't trying to catch you out, I put forward some information that I thought showed that your supposition was incorrect. I'm happy that the weaker pound is good for your business. Genuinely.