1400 cases child abuse -Rotherham

roygbiv6

They do indeed. As I said most countries in western Europe have been saddled with mass immigration. I lived in Holland around the time of Theo Van Gogh and Pym Fortuyn so I am well aware of the cultural & religious tension there. Mass immigration is clearly a coordinated policy and seemingly the more progressive the nation the more it is saddled with. The things that are happening in Sweden currently are very sad for example. That country is being destroyed right now.

But that being said it is more than a matter of numbers but also where people are being imported in from and the usefulness to their society of the people they are importing.
Academics here are currently scratching their heads at the logic of importing people who are now some of the most vulnerable people in Europe into this country who will be a net burden for decades. Importing people from a particularly culturally backwards region of Pakistan into areas like Rotherham and Bradford hasn't exactly gone well has it?

I agree with your last paragraphs as they are in my experience more equal societies but the above is very important too and it could be said that they work hand in hand in making those countries, for me, better places to live.

roygbiv6

So totally back on topic. No single arrest as far as I can see. These sick people are still walking freely. If the perpetrators are known why are they not being picked up? Forget about the blame game and whose heads need to roll that can be worked out later - get these people locked up and away from their victims. They must still be being protected it is as simple as that.

Nothing is going to be done is it? Absolutely nothing.

Trollslayer

The old problem of the institutions protecting themselves instead of those they are supposed to serve.
That's how Saville and his like got away with it.

alexw3

I don't know how it works in other nations, but the issue with the UK is that historically we ruled that region and during that time and after imported significant numbers as a form of cheap labour.  

"Following the Second World War and the break-up of the British Empire, Pakistani immigration to the United Kingdom increased, especially during the 1950s and 1960s. This was made easier because Pakistan was a member of the Commonwealth of Nations.[9] Pakistanis were invited by employers to fill labour shortages which arose after the Second World War. As Commonwealth citizens, they were eligible for most British civic rights. They found employment in the textile industries of Lancashire and Yorkshire, manufacturing in the West Midlands, and car production and food processing industries of Luton and Slough. It was common for Pakistani employees to work on night shifts and at other less-desirable hours.[21]"

Problem is we then had the de-industrialization of the 1970's and that embeded in a culture of deprivation and poverty in what were already poor areas.

We also made it relatively easy for those already here to bring in their family members via marriage and other ways.  Now on simple economic terms given the choice you would choose to live in the UK over pakistan, thus they've been coming here in significant numbers for decades.  They also due to cultural reasons have a higher birth rate, which has added to the higher birth rate that is common among the relatively poor irrespective of colour/race/creed.

Combine all those things together, so that you have a growing number of relatively poorly educated and trained individuals, in area's already deprived, and you set up a powder keg for all sorts of nastiness.  

Note that this is not just a problem for pakistani's in the UK, there are centers of poverty in various places in the UK and they all have their own issues and troubles.   For example glasgow's poor area's have major major issues with alcoholism.  The average lifespan is something like 25 years less than the SE.

The common thread to all of them is endemic poverty, and the way in which the individuals in these area's have become surplus to economic requirements so that they have been thrown on the scrap heap.  Just as the pakistani communities have that used to work in the long-gone factories.  We need to find ways to put the people in these area's to economic use in ways that make them feel they have a valuable part to play in society, can contribute, and get ahead in return for their efforts.  That's not going to happen currently and seems to be getting worse given the winner takes all and loser/winner culture we are fostering.  Telling people to get on their bike just doesn't cut it.  Nor does it work.

Up to yet the soultions proposed by the left have not solved it.  But the solutions proposed by the right have not done so either.  Overall we need a severe rethink of where this country is going, and how we make it a prosperous place for all.  Because what we are doing currently is not working, and all signs suggest it is not going to get better but rather worse.

pragmatic

Its like when labour lost the lost election, there was 6 months to a year of nasal gazing to elect a new leadership, simply no remorse or attempt to help fix the huge problems that we'd been saddled with.  The exception here is that there isn't another group plodding along to pick up the pieces and attempt to sort it out.

All we have is shredder and hard disk wiping on overdrive, and arse covering at an unprecedented level, probably throughout the land.  Don't want to start of precendent of sacking people for incompetence or gross negligence, or as it would seem simply not doing the job their 6 figure salaries are meant to pay for.

There is so much self interest that this might end up sparking riots once people feel nothing is happening, good job we've got an election around the corner we might get to tougher laws allowing ministers to directly sack (senior) public servant on the statute books.

Step 1, clean up the street, get these gromers and users of their 'businesses' locked up.  Strip passports from anyone that can be, this is an affront and should be dealt with in the strongest way, nothing is stronger than sending them back to whatever back water they came from.
Step 2, sack all the people related to this
Step 3, build a new level of trust, a contract with the general public, they are meant to be our servant not our masters.
Step 4, learn some actual lessons from this, find out route causes and stop this from being repeated.

Step 0, ongoing care for the victims, they need real help and it will probably be life long.

While I'm not a fan of the blame for a claim culture, here we would have seen this a lot quicker if these victims had the ability to sue the council/police/social services as well as these sick individuals including the ones who where 'customers' of the gangs for big money.  This is an area it is needed, not people falling off a ladder or slipping on a wet floor due to their own inability to look out for their own safety.

Trollslayer

A good objective analysis.

pragmatic

While that is true for people who've been here since the 70's the flood of people entering over the last decade and a half with seemingly the same problem of no or low quality/paid work is significantly greater.  As you say for cultural reasons people congregate in areas where there are established populations, but they are also often the areas without any meaningful employment.

Why are we allowing immigration that doesn't add to the economic or social contribution (e.g. nurses) of the country?  Statistically immigrants from outside the EU cost the economy per head, these figures seem to not take into aspects like in work benefits though which are often as high as out of work benefits or even higher.  This state top up certainly makes the quality of life significantly better than back home for most, that's before the inalienable benefits the rule of law, law abiding citizen and general level of safety and free good quality heath care etc that the UK provides as standard.  The fact the government effectively pays to house everyone is also quite a bonus.

We need a real points based system and cultural compatibility should also be an aspect, just don't ask me how to measure that!  Sure let in competent doctors and nurses etc, but we should question why 'restaurants' need to employ Bangladeshi chefs for poverty wages The curry crisis | Life and style | The Guardian
Lets train some people and stop importing, but to be honest this is another sign of bend over backwards hypocrite Britain, if an English fish and chip shop or Irish bar specified the nationality needed for employment they would rightful be hounded as racist.

alexw3

What you are describing is a rentier capitalist society -

"Rentier capitalism is a term currently used to describe economic practices of parasitic monopolization of access to any (physical, financial, intellectual, etc.) kind of property, and gaining significant amounts of profit without contribution to society"

Where it is the well paid jobs that are the property being monopolized by the well connected where they are gaining significant "profit"
For 99.8% of jobs we don't need to import workers from either the EU or non-EU nations.  If a shortage of workers arises it will force those who want workers to raise wages and/or train.

If they still can't find workers then they will invest in capital instead to make current workers more productive.  It's called productivity and it's what has driven standards of living ever higher for hundreds of years.

This is the supply and demand paradigm which works for everything else but gov's won't let work in employment markets.  As for why they won't, follow the money (and votes) and see who benefits from the current paradigm.

pragmatic

Looks like my own question to the end there has been answered Mastara Chef: Apprenticeship scheme aims to tackle ethnic skills shortage need to earn at least £30k a year and speak English, hopefully combine that with the closing of many of the student visa loopholes were people were effectively working much of this will sort itself out, although may see a rise in people trafficking if 'official routes' are taken away.

pragmatic

Highlighting some of the cultural issues which allowed this to happen from the perpetrators side

Rotherham child sexual abuse scandal - the lessons: Asian women's voices go unheard - Comment - Voices - The Independent

Ironically showing the cultural issues allowing the establishment, institutions created for the sole purpose of protecting victims, prosecuting perpetrators and providing support when they fail in this duty, can be seen here:

Rotherham inquiry: the ‘PC gone mad’ defence is itself a form of racism | Jonathan Freedland | Comment is free | The Guardian

Some of the strongest double speak I've seen in a while, not sure who he's trying to convince but from the comments its purely the choir who are nodding, as even the congregation is queasy at this.