The State knows what's best for your children?

Cliff

Highlighted by this sad case of the parents of a child who had a specific cancer affecting the brain.
The doctors said that proton beam therapy, which is more precise, instead of the usual radio thereby, was not available on the NHS. They insisted it would not do any good anyway. The Dad wanting the best treatment checked on the internet and found that it was widely available outside Britain and was promising for this kind of tumour. (Radio therapy will probably cause brain damage)

So he said he would take his child out of the Hospital. That's when the full force of the Big Brother State comes in. They were told by the doctor/ hospital authorities that if the dad questioned the treatment and wanted to take him out of the hospital, then the child could be taken away from them  under an Emergency Protection Order--and taken into care!!

The family fled to Spain to sell their house for treatment abroad.

Meanwhile, an international arrest warrant for Child neglect was issued and the Spanish police have arrested the mum and dad. They have been arrested and separated from the child who is being looked after in a Spanish hospital.

It gets worse... The Dad will be extradited to England for questioning and possible charges of Kidnap/ neglect etc.

it is no wonder that the advice from family lawyers these days that if there is a suspicion that the doctors want to take your child away, even over night because of an odd bruise or whatever, then flee the country asap. Once in child care the next step is adoption and then you have lost your child forever.

Its like the state owns your children and of course knows best.

kav

What's your source for this info Cliff? Just curious as it's the first I have heard of it.

pragmatic

Yes this whole thing has a stink about it, I wasn't even aware of the alternative treatment angle, the media were treating it like a kidnap.  Why are people so worried about what a parent is doing with his children simply because it is against doctors orders, while we have the continued abuse of children in cases like Rotherum across the country.

The country seems to have gone mad.

alexw3

Errr the state doctor probably does know what treatment is best for a particular type of cancer.  Do you know if proton beam therapy is better for medulloblastoma with that child's particular case history rather than his actual treatments, on a cost vs benefit vs risk ratio?

If proton beam theraphy is a more precise treatment then it would depend on the spread of the cancer would it not?

Who do you think is the best person to make that judgement?  The parent or a doctor?

pragmatic

Does the parent not have authority over is?

Or does the moment someone enter a hospital they are now under the control of the state?

Cliff

Its been on Sky news this morning and the dad posted his side of the story on Youtube -- before he was arrested!  In fact he said how surprised he was to find his sons photo plastered all over the newspapers with the story that he had kidnapped/ neglected his son.

The cost is about £90k /time. The NHS has also made a statement saying they they do send people abroad in some cases.

The amazing thing, is that the Southampton police have made a statement saying they are not going to apologize, even though the situation is clear now.  They repeat the mantra that they are only looking after the welfare of the child. However, to me its quite the reverse. The father was videod with his son today on and is obviously doing his very best for his son and is prepared to pay the cost himself by selling his Spanish home and get treatment.

They are still going through with the extradition proceedings. like he was some drug dealer.

pragmatic

We have a huge issue with these public services thinking they own us, shown again and again.

alexw3

Typically if the parent is going to do something that may significantly harm the child the state has control.  There have been cases where jahova's witnesses such as his parents have refused treatment on religious grounds, in those cases the state ignores the parents wishes in order to save the childs life.

Typically the state can only over-rule if the patient is a child or is not mentally capable in some way.

Teenage Jehovah's Witness refuses blood transfusion and dies - Telegraph

I do not know what is best in this case but it shoul be a medical based a decision and on those grounds its doubtful the parents know whats best.

Cliff

The dad had consulted doctors abroad including the US and they said that in a case such as this then they would recommend Proton Beam. If radio therapy is used it can damage other parts of the brain. It was not like Proton therapy was available by the way.

Medically that is a debate that can be had.

But....

If the dad wants to spend his money on what might be his terminally ill child, then I think he should be free to do so.

More important...What right does a doctor have to enforce his decision by the threat of removing the child and putting him into care.

And now a extradition? For what? So the father can have a cosy chat in the Southampton nick while his son remains in Spain?
Mad...

johntheexpat

The state doctor probably knows what treatment is available under a cost benefit analysis of the condition.  The doctor may also know what is available as state of the art therapy, but can't be had in the UK.  (S)he can't recommend that treatment because if they do, the NHS has to pay up or the media will create havoc.

The motives of the parents have to be more closely analysed before any of us (or the media or police) criticise them.  If the proton beam therapy was available in Spain and the child is being prepped for it, then any actions to stop that should be condemned by all sides.

But without more facts, .......