Iran's Nuclear Ambitions

krish

As we have seen in the news, Israel has acquired substantial evidence that Iran has been lying about their efforts to have a nuclear weapons capability.

It is said that they have been maintaining their progress on ice for use at a future date, meanwhile continuing their research into individual aspects of nuclear weapon development to add to their vault of knowledge.

I was in favour of the nuclear deal with Iran and was dismayed to see the chickenhawks in US political circles try to talk down and undermine what seemed to be a good arrangement. I thought it stupid to play into the hands of the hawks in Iran, eager to never be bound.

Indeed I was and am still in favour of trying to get Iran to change its mind over Israel and allow them to prosper. However if they have been continuing to aim for nuclear weapons in the way Israel has just revealed, we must think again about Iran.

How does this situation strike members of the forum here ?

robel

Strategically timed bullsh*t from Netanyahu to add to Trump's catalogue of lies over JCPOA, leading up to pull out. The signs are already there with Pompeo and Bolton in place, and Macron's reacharound couldn't reach that.

Good article in The Atlantic ...
What Netanyahu Did and Didn't Say About Iran's Nuclear Program

tapzilla2k

How trust worthy is the leadership in Iran? That is the question.

They supply and fund Hizbolla throughout the region. They're in Lebanon, they are in Syria supporting Assad and we all know what he's doing, they are in the Yemen with the Houthis.

They carryout the murder of innocent civilians around the world, like they did in Argentina and are active via their proxys in other parts of South America.

Israel has always maintained that they will act if they feel that game changing weaponry is getting into the wrong hands and I am right behind Israel on that front.

raduv1

Maybe so. But I've long suspected that Iran either has everything in place ready to go on a nuclear war head or they have one ready to assemble but are awaiting the go ahead from the ayatollah to do so.

For those gun ho about military action ? Iran's nuclear sites are either near religious sites or in areas of heavy civilian population. It would probably take several weeks of intense air raids to cripple Iran's nuclear weapons programme, and Israel just hasn't got the fire power to do that and also cope with Iran using Hezbollah to attack Israel (Hezbollah may have gotten it's hands on chemical weapons, hence the reason for some of the air raids by Israel in Syria). The US has the means to do it and Bolton is back. Of course if it looks like Trump is about to attack Iran (he'll tweet about it), then that's the time I'd expect Iran to either show they've got nuclear weapons with a spectacular demonstration or they'll test a small device that doesn't so much go bang as fizzles.

Put simply I think its too late to prevent Iran from gaining Nuclear Weapons and if that is the case, then it won't be long until Saudi Arabia gets in on Nuclear Weapons. A Nuclear weapons arms race is the last thing the world needs in the Middle East.
   
As for North Korea ? I'll believe it when I see it, wouldn't put it past Kim Jong Un to pull off some kind of stunt to show he hoodwinked the world.

weaviemx5

I never believed Iran's claim that they hadn't been trying for the bomb.  I was prepared to believe they were coooperating with the agreement. I also had and continue to have optimism that the government of Iran is only that for a time and is eventually going to go, after all it is heavily disliked by the country's young and educated population.

If what Israel has shown us is correct, it makes it difficult for parties like the US to focus on the agreement and gradual normalisation of relations. While those young and educated people in Iran don't like their government, they do pull together patriotically when the outside world threaten or try to dictate to them. The sneaky nuclear ambition of their government now exposed, thus leads to a viscious circle that means the organically growing opposition internally may end up turned around in solidarity because of that patriotism. Sad but true.

I'm sure we're all agreed, there isn't a worse place in the world to have a nuclear arms race. It would not surprise me at all if the Sauoodies could acquire them next week, off the shelf from Pakistan, whose bomb program is even refered to as the Islamic one.

I don't mind Israel having them because that's different and I trust them. Its Israel's enemies that threaten the existence of a neigbouring country, not the other way round.

weaviemx5

Funny how a country that has nuclear weapons, isn't a member of NPT, and isn't a part of JCPOA has so much to say about iran and the region. Anything to distract from his own criminal activities I spose and to continue his fear mongering painting iran amongst others to be the boogey man. But he will undoubtedly have US backing on this front.

weaviemx5

Exactly this.  I've read several articles today from different news sources (Sky and the article linked about by Krish) and both had the same underlying statement that Netanyahu shared nothing new at all but just enjoyed the stage and is setting up an option for his best buddy Trump to rip up the nuclear agreement.  From the actual 'evidence' he shared, there didn't appear to be anything previously unknown so it's hard to see it as anything other than showmanship to butter up America.

robel

As above, what are your thoughts about the trustworthy Israel having nuclear weapons but not actually being a member of the JCPOA or the NPT and have instead denied (or, at least, not admitted to) any nuclear capability?

Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons - Wikipedia

"Four states—India, Israel, Pakistan, and South Sudan—have never signed the treaty. India and Pakistan have publicly disclosed their nuclear weapon programs, and Israel has a long-standing policy of deliberate ambiguity with regards to its nuclear program (see List of states with nuclear weapons)."

weaviemx5

A country that hasn't signed such a treaty isn't breaking it by having nukes.

Ambiguity is a good policy with regard to nuclear weapons in general.

I don't mind Israel having nukes really because they are surrounded by states who want, wanted or may in future want to obliterate her. And Israel are the good guys of the middle east anyway, who are the shining beacon of enlightenment and contribution to humanity, in an otherwise dreadful region of backwardness, negativity and hatefulness.

Israel isn't going to go on the rampage against her neighbours and they would only use their nuclear weapons if their backs were utterly against the wall because her neighbours had gone on the rampage against Israel. In which case Israel's enemies would be poofed out of existence by great big thermonuclear bombs and serve them right that would too.

Tell me, if Iran wasn't lying about not having a nuclear weapons program, even if just in the past, how do you explain those files the PM talked about ? If Iran never had a program, why would there exist such research files and be kept on ice in a warehouse ?  Is the PM and the Israeli government lying ? And why would they lie ?

weaviemx5

You really do love Israel don't you.  Clearly you're never going to see anything but light and goodness coming from them and Netanyahu so it's difficult to reason but, with regards to the existing files, you said it yourself.  In the past (up to 2015 before the JCPOA was signed), Iran did have a nuclear program so therefore had, I would assume, a considerable amount of documentation surrounding it.  The fact that Israel have now, conveniently, 'discovered' this stock-pile of documentation just as Trump is parading around the chest-beating idea of ripping up the agreement stinks of propaganda and you're happily going along with it.

I don't deny that the documentation is there, I have no evidence to suggest otherwise, the over-excited delivery and Powerpoint slideshow stating that, "Iran Lied" is just hilarious though;

                                                                                                                                                 

In other news, bears really do s**t in the woods and the Pope is Catholic.