Teacher Shortage Crisis

EarthRod

In prehistoric times children who were naughty got punished and children who were good got rewarded. Children therefore knew the boundaries and the difference between right and wrong. All part of survival and knowing the system and where the child stood in the system. Fear is a very good survival mechanism and teaches respect and humility (prehistoric word) for those with greater power.

Those who are fearless tend not to last long under dangerous or extremely stressful conditions.

I shall now go and sit on the naughty stair.

Cliff

That is a text book answer from 2016. I don't know whether you have children or not but discipline is important. You put it down to poor parenting, but a lot of children copy their mates at school. They bring that behaviour home.

Its not just being naughty, its showing a lack of respect towards teachers, parents and teachers.
Maybe we teach the children they are equals. But really, there may be many factors.
Just my observations from seeing how young children behave these days.

Hpi_matrix

My partner is currently an NQT, she loves teaching but there are a few issues which mean she doesnt see herself doing it in 5 years time unless we move abroad:

1. Workload
2. Poor management
3. Parents

tapzilla2k

That reads like "back in the good old days". Physical violence is not the way to instil respect as all you are doing is using fear as a method of control. In fact my last school while they had a no bullying policy and made you sign a piece of paper to say you wouldn't do it had zero impact. It was rife and no amount of bollocking from various teachers worked, unless it was Mr Flanningan. Nobody messed with him, he was rather fond of telling the story of telling the IRA to sod off and legging it, this was at the height of the troubles. Caning wouldn't have worked either, as there were a lot of violent morons at that school (I had my head karate chopped, went a bit woozy. Had an uppercut punch and was nearly knocked out. Mr Flannigan saw it). I had a flick knife held at my throat one lunchtime and various other things. And another pupil who'd been suspended/expelled took his maths teachers car for a joyride.

I did have some goodtimes there, made some excellent friends. But we had to stick to our groups to fend off those who thought they were cool. Who don't seem to be doing so well as adults. I do not miss St Augustines and like others was glad when it was finally bulldozed to make way for new houses.
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This is why fast tracking academies is bonkers The Dominic Barberi Multi Academy Company has £900k deficit - BBC News

That'll be the School that replaced St Augustines.

alan280170

Yes it instills fear but also makes you behave in class (for the benefit of those who wanted to learn), my old school was the most vandalized in Aberdeen 80's and was one of the very first to get a police station in the school building.

There were many toerags for sure, but I also know many many people from my year and my siblings years that have gone onto great things. But I have been to funerals of school friends that died young and know of about 6 that have done some decent time for drugs etc.


Getting the belt or the cooler was a rite of passage and certainly instilled some manners in many. Plus back in the day if the teacher or a copper came to your house about your behavior you were damn sure going to get a hiding from your parents.

Is it right or wrong, there is discipline and there is cruelty and it's a fine line.

rustybin

Aside from any other argument against corporal punishment in schools, you'd really struggle to find a single teacher who would be willing to add 'beating naughty children' to their to-do list.

alan280170

That's because the PC Brigade has been on the case for about 25 years.

rustybin

No, it's because the thought of being paid to hit children sickens me. However I'm sure it would attract a certain sort of individual to the profession, so it could improve the current recruitment crisis.

If a child in mainstream education requires regular beatings to keep them in check, something has gone seriously wrong and no amount of caning would make any difference.

alan280170

In the 70's and 80's (my era) teachers weren't paid to hit children, but they did have a lot of leeway on corporal punishment to keep classes in line. I had the belt several times and the cooler, never did me any harm, looking back I did some stupid sh*t at school and probably deserved it. The belt was better than getting expelled and then getting a shoeing at home when you tell your mum why you're expelled.

Speaking to my mates now, we hold no "grudge against any teachers for giving us 5 of the best", actually some that have kids now wish the teachers could be harder with some of the scrotes that fudge around in school and the feckless parents don't really care.

Nowadays you hear about teachers getting assaulted etc, didn't hear much back in the day (sure it must have happened). Can you actually get expelled these days even?

rustybin

You can, but the Government 'punishes' schools for doing it and so they do everything they can to keep children in, often to the detriment of the other children. Exclusion is extremely expensive.

The number of places at 'special' schools - behaviour management places especially - have been decimated in recent years in the name of inclusion. As with everything these days, it all boils down to cost cutting.

What might have met threshold 10 years ago, probably wouldn't even justify an assessment today.