Hot shoe Screen?

Peakoverload

Bit of an odd question but...

Whilst I've been shooting digital for many, many years I do still love shooting film. As well as my 5D MKIII DSLR I have a Canon 5 35mm SLR and have just started getting into medium format film as well.

Whilst in terms of image resolution there is little point in shooting medium format film as most modern DSLR's are now of a higher resolution there are still 3 things that MF does 'better'.

1. Waist level viewfinder. It does take some time to get used to but you get an angle of view that id often just more 'interesting'. There is also an added advantage, especially in street photography, in that as you are always looking down at your camera people don't think you are taking a photo of them.

2. Aspect ratio. Personally I love the 6x6 format and the 6x4.5 is also very nice in the right situation. Obviously you can crop but it's easier to view it in camera in the format you want the photo to be in. This coupled with the angle of view from a waist level viewfinder is often a very good combination.

3. Film stocks. Yes they can be emulated in Lightroom but real film still has a certain quality.

Of these 3 things, 2 of them can be recreated to a certain extent in Lightroom. A waist level viewfinder can't. This got me thinking about mounting a small screen on the hotshoe of a camera and using liveview to mimick a waist level viewfinder. The only one I've found is a Viltrox DC-50 which looks very good if perhaps a bit big. Does anyone know of a smaller one? Is there a way of mounting say an iPhone on the hotshoe and having that be a live view monitor via an app and if so how much latency is there?

rancidpunk

I wasn't even aware that such a thing exists. I like the sound of it as articulating screens on a DSLR, at least with Nikons, really aren't a substitute for a viewfinder.

newbie1

I picked up a second hand Sony screen recently and it works very well, but quite bulky and you have the hdmi cable sticking out too.

I have seen an iPad attached too, but the cable and app (I forget which) where very expensive.

Remote control via apps is another solution (but would need a camera body change)

AMc

I often shoot my Olympus cameras hanging from the strap with the screen tilted up at 90 degrees.
It’s great except in very bright sun.

You can also control the camera over WiFi. There is a bit of latency and the live view isn’t perfect. I don’t think I’d use that option with a mounted phone unless you can tether with a wire of some sort.

12harry

Roll film formats were prior to 35mm ( which was a mighty revolution once it begat SLR's), and it was available in "Folding-cameras" for the consumer. The Twin Lens reflex with the waste-level finder was robust, expensive and popular with pros,  since focussing was sharp and swift.... although pressmen could use the eye-level peephole and the ability to hold above yr hear while framing the subject.... =very useful for catching Politicos, or Actors that are trying to avoid the Pressmen.

The snag IMHO is that using cameras at waist-level gives a distorted view, except for Landscape; - in that you have to tilt the camera up to get head-room . . .  not an issue for children / family-seated of course. Ideally portraits are taken with the lens close to the subjects eye-line level.

Many mirrorless and DSLRs have a screen that can be adjusted to suit a waist-level viewing, but it's not convenient, being pressed against you. Also, for action shooting using the camera at eye-level is probably faster - but I accept the idea that in crowds the photographer may go unnoticed with a waist-level stance..... Much the same applies to shooting movies, using a DSLR where you can appear to be adjusting the lens, or waiting for the crowd to clear.... when using a still-camera, in "movie" mode...
As with most camera-variants. . . we are restricted to the outpourings of a narrow band of "Focus-Groups" - that always appear to deliver the same verdicts . . . hence almost all cameras are near-enough the same.  Brand-loyalty really only stretches to the lens-mounts.
As to medium-format film.... can't remember the last film I processed....but do have fond memories for my Mamiya 23 - which was a poor-man's Linhof  - it shot 8 on 120 so was similar aspect to 35mm, but 6x the area, reducing film-grain....but suffered from limited lens range ( although my 50mm is 35-equiv to 25mm).....The arrangement of rangefinder was mechanically poor but the big issue was really expensive and small-aperture lenses.
Its saving grace ( very rarely used) was the film-back was mounted on Bellows, so you could skew the plane of focus . . . I used this once for a piano-keys shot..... but it not a technique available to DSLRs . . . and I do sometimes wonder why.....
The book "View-Camera-Technique"  is a mine of information on Lenses and  changes to the focal-planes, for special effects.

Nowadays, faults like "converging-verticals" can be fixed in software in moments . . . . but is not often seen in practice... I guess the surge in Public-produced pictures has lowered our perceptions of what  "Quality Photography" really is . . . we are apparently so impressed with the cute and silly.


Cheers.

wysinawyg

Most new cameras have a tiltable LCD to give the same effect don't they?  I think 5D IV being about the most recent that doesn't.

There are tons of monitors like the DC50 - Small Focus HD is the daddy - expensive and about the same size.  The problem is that they're all designed for videographers and need HDMI plus a (generally beefy) battery.  For your use the ideal would be a built in Li-Ion battery with a smaller screen - but I don't think anyone makes it.

Certainly Canon and Sony (and presumably Nikon) do apps that give you live view.  Mini-hot shoe to ball mount and an iphone mount and you'd be able to do the phone on top thing.  Janky looking, fragile (physically ad stability of connection wise) and a decent amount of latency - but probably usable for street.  

You'd definitely be attracting attention with an iPhone stuck on top of a DSLR though! (or the monitor version for that matter)

Peakoverload

Thanks for all the replies. I'm not in the market to replace my 5D MKIII (my wife would kill me plus it's more than good enough for my needs) so that does restrict the options. I had thought about a right angle eyepiece but I don't think that's practical.

The whole thing probably isn't practical which is part of why I like the idea of still shooting medium format film. Certainly MF film isn't as versatile as digital and you wouldn't use it all the time but there are some areas where I think it's still relevant and not just in a studio. Whilst I understand about the 'odd' angle of view, again I think there are times when it's an advantage. I've seen a number of portraits taken from waist level that work beautifully but yes it certainly doesn't work for all hence why you can also get 'normal' viewfinders or use the 'sports' viewfinder on a TLR.

In fact I'm more surprised that DSLR camera manufacturers don't offer in camera crop to say a 6x6 format. Obviously that's throwing pixels away but you'd do that anyway in Photoshop if you wanted that effect. If you can do things like convert to B&W in camera than why not a square crop and better still why not give a live view of a square crop? Probably a limited market but doesn't seem difficult to do.

AMc

I think the idea of the waist level view being "odd" for portraits is nonsense.
Shoot from eye level close in with a wide lens and you get can get a "bobble head".
If you want a head or head and shoulders portrait then sure you may want your camera at chest or eye height or higher but the height of the camera will have a pronounced impact on the tone of the picture.
I was told by a good friend who shoots dancers that dropping to one knee was one of the most important things he'd learnt.
Of course I don't need to do that with an articulating screen

The article here and YouTube video (first google result) illustrate how a different camera height can work.
https://www.picturecorrect.com/tips/how-to-improve-your-portraits-by-using-the-right-camera-height/

On your point about square cropping.  My Olympus cameras let you choose from 4:3, 16:9, 3:2, 1:1 or 3:4.  The display and EVF show the cropped image but if you save to JPG RAW then you get the full sensor RAW with the crop premarked.
It can be handy to use along with things like the live B&W mode as you get a good idea how the result will look but the full flexibility of the RAW file to post process with a different crop, colour profile etc.

Bl4ckGryph0n

I love the waist level finders as well. My Mamiya is brilliant like that, and just like the OP I like the perspective it provides for street photography.

And my Olympus PEN EP5 also has one build in. So even in the digital age I use it a lot.