SD card footage only looks good when viewed on TV through camcorder, nowhere else

Trickster30

Hello all,

Hope this is in the right forum for this post.

I have recently purchased a Sony 4K camcorder (FDR-AX700).

To go with it, I purchased 2 x SD cards (SanDisk Extreme Pro SDXC UHS-I Card, 256GB, Speed up to 95 MB/s 633X - have taken a screenshot, see attached). When put in the camera, I was prompted to format them which I did.

I have shot footage both in 4K and HD.

I have viewed this footage on my 4K TV by directly connecting the camcorder to the TV (via a HDMI cable). The picture looks great and I am very happy with it.

However.... (there's always a however                                                                                                                                         https://www.avforums.com/file:///C:/Users/richh/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif        ) this seems to be the only way where the footage looks this good.

When I downloaded the clips to my PC (using the cable provided, and using Sony memories which is the software with the camera) and played the clips back, the clips deteriorate in quality. Not massively but more than enough for it to be noticed. This is especially prevalent with movement. Its no-where near as smooth. Also, I think the colours are not quite as vivid.

I assumed this was just down to PCs not playing clips as well as a dedicated 4K TV. So, I put it the clips through premiere pro, outputted it matching the source settings, and viewed that on the 4K TV via an external hard drive that I use. The clips look exactly the same as they did on the PC (i.e. not as good).

Again, I wondered whether it was just down to a combination of the clips naturally not looking so great on a PC, and also maybe the quality dropping somehow by putting it through premiere pro (though never had that issue before)

So, in trying to isolate the problem, I have taken the SD card out of the camcorder. My 4K TV has its own slot for SD cards so I can play the clips back directly onto the TV. But, when doing this, the quality is exactly the same as the PC and the outputted footage (not as good). This seems to be the same whether its shot in HD or 4K.

So, it looks as if the clips look great when played on the TV through the camcorder, but when the SD card is played elsewhere, the quality diminishes. So, maybe the camcorder does something when playing the clips back (compresses it somehow) that it doesn't do elsewhere. Or maybe I have not got good enough cards.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I think the camera itself is absolutely fine, but I just can’t figure out why the clips on the SD card (which are digital) would lose any quality when played elsewhere

Many thanks,
Richard

JabbaNut

Is this the card ?

Extreme PRO SDHC/SDXC UHS-I Memory Card | SanDisk


Have you recorded in HDR and can TV and PC display HDR ?

JabbaNut

From Sony UK

Sony FDR-AX700 4K HDR Camcorder

Recording Format (Video)
    AVCHD format ver.2.0 compatible:MPEG4-AVC/H.264, XAVC S format: MPEG4-AVC/H264, XAVC S Proxy: MPEG-4 AVC/H.264
Video Resolution
    [NTSC] XAVC S 4K: 3840 x 2160/30p, 24p XAVC S HD: 1920 x 1080/120p, 60p, 30p, 24p AVCHD: 1920 x 1080/60i (FX, FH), 1440 x 1080/60i (LP) XAVC S Proxy: 1280 x 720/60p, 30p, 24p, 640 x 360 60p, 30p, 24p [PAL] XAVC S 4K: 3840 x 2160/25p XAVC S HD: 1920 x 1080/100p, 50p, 25p AVCHD: 1920 x 1080/50i (FX, FH), 1440 x 1080/50i (LP) XAVC S Proxy: 1280×720/50p,25p, 640×360/50p,25p

XAVC S 4K : Approx.100Mbps, 60Mbps56, XAVC S HD: Approx.100Mbps (1920 x 1080/120p,100p), 60Mbps (1920 x 1080/120p,100p), 50Mbps, 25Mbps, 16Mbps/56 AVCHD FX: Approx. 24Mbps, FH: Approx.17Mbps, LP: Approx. 5Mbps56, XAVC S Proxy: Approx.9Mbps (1280×720)/Approx.3Mbps (640×360) 56

Are you in UK and did you record in Pal

Is TV NTSC or PAL ?

JH4

Are you sure that you are always looking at the 4K files ? You may be looking at the smaller lower res. files that sometimes get recorded at the same time.  Depending on how you have set up the recording modes. If that makes sense !

chrishull3

SanDisk Extreme Pro SDXC UHS-I Card, 256GB is what i use and they are fine even for 50P 150Mbps 4K for me,i load my files on to my pc via a card reader,what does your 4K edited footage look like played back on your tv and what are you rendering your films to, external drives is what i make films onto and they look the same as the origional clips playing back.Your is a strange situation i have never used the (FDR-AX700).

Trickster30

Thanks all for your helpful replies.

Jabbanut,
Yes, that is the card. Is the 256GB version.
I have recorded in both 4K and HD. Im not sure the TV is HDR (don't think it is). And PC probably isn't either. Though, when I play the clips on the TV (directly from the camera) it looks fine.

Sony UK,
Yes, I am in the UK, and I am UK. I assume I am shooting in PAL. I haven't come across an option to change this, and as I purchased this in the UK, I am assuming it is in PAL.

JH4,
Yes I am pretty sure. There is a proxy setting in the camera which records at both the mode you have selected (4K/HD) and a low-res version as well. I made sure this was switched to off before starting.

chrishull3,
The 4K (and HD) footage looks absolutely fine on the TV when played directly from the camcorder (via HDMI cable). But, when I try the following, the clips do not look as smooth and the colour is not quite so sharp:
- Putting the SD card directly into the slot on the TV and playing the files there
- Importing the clips to the PC then just adding those clips to an external drive which I then connect to the TV
I don't have a card reader so am importing the files onto the PC by connecting the camcorder with the leads provided. I agree, it is strange. They are digital clips so you would think the quality would be exactly the same when they are transferred to external drive or even more so when the SD card is in the slot on the TV and playing back directly.

12harry

Reading this Thread, Trickster30 appears to have a difficult problem.  There is no logic in a camcorder "doing something" to your files when they are being processed on a PC, since this process has been at the forefront of Editing for some time - indeed the success of "editing" is that it destroys nothing ( er, except by the User-commands!).
However, I would expect this is replicated by other Buyers in the UK.  Sure, you can discount maybe 50% who simply store their stuff on the Card in the belief that's their Option...and then play it back using the TV ( from the camcorder). So I wonder that you can't let Sony UK know about this.... of course most comments go through a shreader ... =far too many Corporate folks involved in pretending it is the User at Fault.
I bought a Sony product some years ago and this shows its PAL credentials on the supplied sticker - 50i - I have never found this creates problems which haven't been my fault at the filming-moments.
Have you tried these files with ANOther Film-Maker? They could discover a different scenario.... or confirm?  In addition, they could supply HD-files that you can play via the PC.
Whilst it's unlikely to make any difference, I would suggest you buy a modern USB3 card-reader ( so it covers the latest options ), these are typically £20 and could eliminate having to use the play-memories software.... Copy files over in the normal way ( using this new reader), and then perform any Edits - when you Render the Edits, you can put this in a folder of "Rendered Films". Many camcorder Mfrs supply software to "help" users.... but IMHO, this will only delay having to do things properly - and eliminating intermediate software is unlikely to reduce quality.
You should be able to detect files that are "low-res" versions - these might be "Proxy files" which allow Editors to work faster - until the larger files are used to complete the Render-process.
Formatting in the camcorder should mean your cards are correctly formatted and of the right speed.
That you can replay "good quality" must mean the camcorder is capable of good work. I wonder that the TV isn't applying some effect ( e.g.  Sharpening, colour correction ) - and this is being seen as the "original" - whereas, it is of itself a minor corruption. . . .
Yet somehow I feel the problem ( as described), lies elsewhere . . . .

Cheers.

JH4

I reckon the problem lies with the TV. Forget editing the footage. The issue seems to be the difference between the playback via HDMI, and the playback via the SD / HDD USB   input. This may be due to the TV's player...Whatever that may be. Sony TV's with Android can use several different ones, depending on what is loaded or installed later. Some may not play 4k very well.. I have several on my Sony TV that I use for playing files.   Not sure which might solve the problem , tho. I'll investigate further...

JH4

Just checked on my Sony. I have "Video", MX player, Kodi, "Album" Google Play, VLC player. Try using MX or VLC player. That may fix the problem. If the files play OK via HDMI, then they are not the problem..

noiseboy72

I would imagine that the camcorder is recording extra meta-data and is processing the file while playing back. You may well find that it's actually the black level, gamma or chroma that is being adjusted by the camcorder on play back and not the inherent quality of the clip.

Might be worth using a colour chart to see if this is the case.