How to clean up old film. Any tips?

12harry

You didn't say how the Super 8mm film was transferred - there are some transfers that are sprocketless and let the film run continuously. This is then made into the necessary movie files, depending on what you want.
I suspect this is worthwhile only if the camera lens Operator are first-class. However, for lesser "Originals" you may have to resort to a general clean-up.... but the normal process of filming from the projected image means there is likely to be every fault present - but just maybe that's part of the charm of old films?
The quality of Super8 is woeful compared with modern standards, but folk didn't know any better then and it was accepted as being an improvement over Standard 8, which had a smaller image size and ran slower normally...

I would expect the sprocketless process (which uses specialist software) would eliminate those frames that are burnt/overexposed; so you don't have to. Similarly their software should eliminate frame-jitter . . . it's not especially expensive . . . try internet searching.

Good luck.

Richard Jones

You are so right about the quality of old cine film when compared with modern digital video! You are also right about the different frame rates, with Super 8 being slightly faster that Standard 8 and this did help with the quality of the projected image but I had thought that the area of each frame of Super 8 film was in fact slightly smaller (if I remember that was one of the main reasons I delayed making the upgrade but the fact that I was using a Bolex H8 Reflex with a large number and variety of lenses may also have been a factor )

If the transfer from cine to video is done with a proper Telecine machine this will have no sprockets with each frame being shot separately and new frames interpolated to bring the frame rate to 25fps, the TV standard in the UK. A good transfer house will also deal with flash frames, exposure issues and colour problems if they are making a DVD from the original film but if they are merely transferring it to a Hard Drive to leave you to do the editing it is unlikely that these adjustments will have been made.

I have gone down both routes but it is important to make sure of the method of transfer being used by the company as some of their adverts can be distinctly misleading. A reputable company (Timeless Moments and Rutland Productions for example) will do a first rate job and will be happy to talk you through their systems if you call them.

I've edited several miles of film using Vegas Pro. It's a lengthy process and will probably involve each clip of the film being treated as a separate event if only to remove those frames bearing evidence of the original film splicing but the results are well worth while and contain your own individual stamp. It's true it can be expensive but it is easy and convenient and the volume of film you are dealing with means that it can be done in installments to match your own speed of editing and this spreads the costs to make the hit on your purse less painful.

Richard

Cliff

Well I am not sure of the exact process they used. But I have an AV file and inspecting it is frame by frame. i.e. no blurred two frame images that you would see on a projector camera set up. The company was cinefilm2DVD.
But I doubt it was done on a machine like the Muller which runs the film continuously and takes a flash so fast the film movement has little effect. I suspect it was frame by frame machine running slowly and the picture were put together on the computer and converted from 18 to 25fps.
Sound was probably taken off the stripe and added later to the AV file.
I have started doing the same. Each shot will be cut as a separate event and dirty splices can be removed. Colour balance can be done for each event, and some of my films are a mixture of Ektachrome 160ASA and Kodachrome 40ASA so there are big shifts in colour. Can also do fades etc and clean up some of the sound.
In those days we didn't seem to worry too much about camera noise, as the projector noise masked a lot of the clatter. The boom mikes that attached to the camera were the worst and picked up a lot of noise. Now, on a video monitor the camera noise is quite obtrusive.

Its funny how some of the video editing packages include old film effects, like scratches and odd colour balances. Well, no need for those!

Mr.D

The learning edition of NukeX is free as I said . Its missing some features as I said as a result however it does come with Furnace which is probably the class leader in optical flow interpolation.

ColinP

Hi Cliff, I know that this post was a while ago, but it was us (CineFilm2DVD) that did the transfer for you. We use Moviestuff’s Retroscan Universal HD Scanners for all our 8, 9.5 and 16mm film transfers. Always updating equipment as soon as possible. The soundtrack will have been captured from the strip by running it through one of our GS1200 Projectors, directly capturing the sound to PC. It will then have been synced back to the video.
The retro scans don’t use sprockets at all, but have sensors which trigger each frame capture. As Richard says, usually when supplying files, we supply them as is, especially with Sound films.

The reason I am replying on this post is because I have been monitoring our website and it’s metions and back links etc, across the internet. Whilst doing this, it has taken me to lots of forums and I have read lots of complete rubbish regarding transfer of Cine Film. Most of it from people who are just trying to advertise their business. I am so glad that there are knowledgable people like Richard out there. As you say Richard, a lot of ads are misleading with companies using smoke and mirrors, trying to hide the fact that they are using projectors and camcorders or old outdated Transvideo machines. The sad thing is that a lot of people now, don’t quite fully understand Cine Film. They’ve unearthed them or found them when a loved one has passed away and then look to get them transferred. Any results they get, they are just going to take as “that’s just how they are”, because they don’t know any different. I could elaborate a lot on this, and if anyone wants me too I will. I have been a Cine enthusiast since the age of 7...now i’m 51 years young and still loving Cine!

Cliff

Hi Colin, @ColinP
Thanks for the follow up and info on how it was transferred.
Well I didn't go down the AVdub route but did do re edit on Vegas. All scenes was recut and colour corrected. All the old dirty cement splices were replaced with electronic cuts, fades or cross fades.
Some of the filmed titles looked too jerky so were replaced with Vegas generated titles with some fake scratches and a little sprocket movement just to make them look like film!
I loved cine at the time and as a young man just out of university, spent heaps on equipment and film. As I got more serious films  were shot at 24fps and look very professional. The cost was huge! I think 50ft was about £14 for 2m20s ? (24fps)
Must have spent half my first salary cheque on film stock.

ColinP

I too spent an absolute fortune on film. It was quite easily done. However, I was no where near spending as much as a lot of our customers did. We regularly get orders of 20-30x400ft to Transfer....and I thought I was hooked!!

Glad to hear you got it looking how you wanted it.

JabbaNut

Without seeing digital version would be hard to say.

Would of made a copy then have used this programme

WinXDVD Software Giveaway - DVD Video Software Giveaway & Coupon

JabbaNut

You can also use CinemaHD 4 which is given away free now

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